Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement: Difference between revisions

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→‎Result concerning Debresser: EdJohnston does raise a good point.
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{{hat|[[Jerusalem]] is placed under the following page-level restriction: As the results of [[Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jerusalem]] regarding the article's lead represent the community's consensus at a well-attended discussion, a new [[WP:RFC|request for comments]] must be undertaken and reach consensus prior to any changes being made to the article's lead section. This restriction does not in any way prohibit filing such an RfC, only requires that one be filed prior to such changes. [[User:Seraphimblade|Seraphimblade]] <small><sup>[[User talk:Seraphimblade|Talk to me]]</sup></small> 13:23, 4 July 2016 (UTC) }}
==Debresser==
==Debresser==
<small>''This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. <br>Requests may not exceed 500 [[Word count#Software|words]] and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.''</small>
<small>''This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. <br>Requests may not exceed 500 [[Word count#Software|words]] and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.''</small>
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*If it interests anyone, we're currently holding an RFC on GMOs based on the Jerusalem model, and the DS I logged to enforce it is as follows: "A moderated RfC is being held at [[Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Genetically modified organisms]] to determine how to phrase the safety of GM foods across all relevant articles. Whatever consensus is decided shall not be modified or overturned without an equivalent RfC. Additionally, the RFC is under further restrictions listed on that page and in the editnotice, including [[WP:0RR]]." <span style="font-family:Courier New;font-size:3">[[User:The Wordsmith|'''The Wordsmith''']]</span><sup>[[User talk:The Wordsmith|Talk to me]]</sup> 14:34, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
*If it interests anyone, we're currently holding an RFC on GMOs based on the Jerusalem model, and the DS I logged to enforce it is as follows: "A moderated RfC is being held at [[Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Genetically modified organisms]] to determine how to phrase the safety of GM foods across all relevant articles. Whatever consensus is decided shall not be modified or overturned without an equivalent RfC. Additionally, the RFC is under further restrictions listed on that page and in the editnotice, including [[WP:0RR]]." <span style="font-family:Courier New;font-size:3">[[User:The Wordsmith|'''The Wordsmith''']]</span><sup>[[User talk:The Wordsmith|Talk to me]]</sup> 14:34, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
**I support [[User:Seraphimblade]]'s idea of a page-level restriction at [[Jerusalem]] ruling out changes to the lead without a new RfC. I am unsure whether it will be easy to distinguish major from minor changes, so my preference would be to ban all changes, not just changes deemed to be significant. [[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 02:05, 4 July 2016 (UTC)
**I support [[User:Seraphimblade]]'s idea of a page-level restriction at [[Jerusalem]] ruling out changes to the lead without a new RfC. I am unsure whether it will be easy to distinguish major from minor changes, so my preference would be to ban all changes, not just changes deemed to be significant. [[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 02:05, 4 July 2016 (UTC)
{{hab}}


==Wuerzele==
==Wuerzele==

Revision as of 13:23, 4 July 2016


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    Jerusalem is placed under the following page-level restriction: As the results of Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jerusalem regarding the article's lead represent the community's consensus at a well-attended discussion, a new request for comments must be undertaken and reach consensus prior to any changes being made to the article's lead section. This restriction does not in any way prohibit filing such an RfC, only requires that one be filed prior to such changes. Seraphimblade Talk to me 13:23, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

    Debresser

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning Debresser

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    Nableezy (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 22:16, 7 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    Debresser (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jerusalem (I understand Im linking to an RFC here, however that RFC was mandated by ArbCom and is binding through July 9, 2016, and this topic area is covered by discretionary sanctions
    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. 7 June 2016 Revert in violation of binding RFC
    If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
    • Participated in an arbitration request or enforcement procedure about the area of conflict in the last twelve months, on 15 March 2016.
    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    There was a binding RFC on claims to Jerusalem being capital of Israel and Palestine and its location that was mandated by the Arbitration Committee (Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jerusalem). That RFC resulted in the material currently in the lead of the Jerusalem article and per the Arbitration Committee is binding for three years. A user added material to the lead that violated that RFC, was reverted, which was also reverted. This was prior to any talk page discussion. I reverted that final revert and opened a talk page section detailing why (here, with the user I had reverted agreeing that the material shouldnt be included. Debresser then ignores the binding RFC and re-reverts, writing in the talk page Sourced, relevant, neutrally worded. The Rfc is expiring. The Rfc avoided the issue. All in all, ample reason to keep this addition. By the way, is there anything you think is wrong with the text, apart from bureaucratic arguments? When Debresser was reverted he or she posted to that users talkpage that their revert was "hothead revert" (here). Im not quite sure why this user thinks that binding means something other than all users have to follow this, but a reminder is surely in order.


    Re the idea that this is a personal issue, no, not at all. Debresser is the only one to have reverted following the explanation that the material violated a binding RFC. And when asked to revert declined to do so. And then complained when somebody reverted him or her. Debresser's comment on the talk page of that article implied that he or she felt that a binding RFC did not apply to him or her. That is what brought me here. nableezy - 00:09, 8 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Sorry Debresser, I guess an edit summary that says the RFC is expiring in a month, a comment on the talk page saying the edit should stand, a comment on the talk page of the person that reverted you calling their revert hotheaded, those things dont lead to the reasonable conclusion that a. you knew that you were prohibited from making said edit due to a binding revert, b. didnt care, and c. wouldnt self-revert. Silly me, where could I have possibly gotten that idea. You know what I find disruptive? Editors thinking the rules that apply to everybody else dont apply to them. Editors who knowingly revert against a consensus (thats what an RFC determines fyi). Basically, you. nableezy - 21:11, 8 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    @OID, I object to that edit on a number of grounds. However, the rule breaking is what is relevant on this board for a topic area that is covered under discretionary sanctions. Bright line rules only work if when somebody breaks them there isnt hand waving about well its only a technicality.

    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

    Notified

    Discussion concerning Debresser

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by Debresser

    Nableezy seems to have a personal issue with me, because of the three editors who made this same edit,[2][3][4] I am the only one he is reporting. Nableezy has a huge POV in the I/P-conflict area, and we have conflicted on many articles already. He is now trying to fight his personal vendetta against me through the editors at WP:AE. I think that is fair reason to dismiss this report. Recently he engaged in an edit wat at Ancient synagogues in Palestine,[5][6][7] for which I decided not to report him. I am disappointed that he should repay me in this way.

    As to the actual matter at hand, I think Talk:Jerusalem#addition_to_the_lead is where the discussion is taking place, and where I have made my arguments, and have already stated, that I will not challenge the Rfc, which stands till July 9. At the same time, I think the issue will have to be re-visited in the near future, if only to avoid edit wars, blocks and a lot of bad blood, and the proposed edit is a very good NPOV candidate, summing up the issue well and along the same lines as the Rfc.

    In short, I think this report should boomerang back on Nableezy for the blatant personal motives behind this report, as well as his own recent WP:ARBPIA violations on "Ancient synagogues in Palestine".Debresser (talk) 23:36, 7 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    @EdJohnson The 9 July date comes from counting 3 years after the Rfc reached a conclusion. Debresser (talk) 09:51, 8 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    @Nableezy No need to say things you can't possibly know. I didn't refuse to revert. Somebody else reverted my edit even before I read your post on my talkpage. You continue with your bad faith assumptions, viewing Wikipedia as a battlefield, and me as the enemy. I find this attitude of yours disruptive. Debresser (talk) 21:01, 8 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    @GoldenRing I know it is not advised to antagonize editors here, but I don't understand what further "backing down" is needed, after I have already stated both here and on the talkpage that I will not challenge the status quo? You did read my posts here and on the talkpage, didn't you? Debresser (talk) 10:56, 10 June 2016 (UTC) @GoldenRing In view of the above, neither do I understand what you claim I am "doubling down on". Debresser (talk) 19:06, 12 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    @GoldenRing The Rfc specifically states that the consensus reached in it is binding only for a 3-year period. There is no rule on Wikipedia that an Rfc is needed to establish consensus, including to establish if there has been a change of consensus. A simple talkpage discussion, or even a bold edit that is accepted by the community, per definition can establish a new consensus. Debresser (talk) 11:35, 10 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    @User:Newyorkbrad Ha, ha. That's a good one. Debresser (talk) 04:35, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    @Seraphimblade I don't think you are correct. See my comment above to GoldenRing, that there is no rule that an Rfc must be followed by an Rfc. Any way of establishing consensus is valid. The only exception could perhaps be, if such a stipulation were made specifically in the first Rfc, as in the current example provided by The Wordsmith below. Debresser (talk) 14:28, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by OID

    Ed, dates from RFC's are always taken from the closure of an RFC as that is the point at which consensus has been determined by the closer. There would be no point in a fixed for 3 years consensus being valid until the actual consensus was determined. Saying that, it would still be up in a month anyway, so suggest close with trouts for everyone. Nableezy, if you have to rely on technical rule-breaking to revert an edit, rather than addressing the substance of the edit, it tends to get peoples backs up. 'Would this edit be controversial in a months time?' should be the question you ask yourself. Only in death does duty end (talk) 10:28, 8 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Comment by GoldenRing

    I think Timoetheus has the right of it here; RfCs do not expire as such. Consensus can change, but the right way to go about changing consensus established in an RfC is a new RfC, not gung-ho edits to the article before the time limit established by the RfC has even expired and especially not in an article as contentious as this one. I suggest User:Debresser backs down and apologises and we let this lie; if not, sanctions are probably appropriate. GoldenRing (talk) 10:21, 10 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    @Debresser: Consensus is always binding. It doesn't expire. I read the three-year limit in that RfC as essentially the same as a moratorium on further discussion. But however you read it, the essential point is that it hasn't expired. Of course it doesn't take an RfC to establish consensus - but when one has been held, a change made without any discussion whatsoever doesn't cut it. Since you're doubling down on this, I can't see what else to recommend but sanctions. GoldenRing (talk) 21:35, 10 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by ZScarpia

    Consensus-wise, where things will probably now turn ugly is that there are perceptions among some editors that consensus is established by carrying out a show of hands and that personal opinions, rather than the contents of reliable sources, establish what is factual and what is neutral.     ←   ZScarpia   17:35, 11 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by Sir Joseph

    An RFC is not consensus. Simple as that. It is a ruling that must be followed but when that ruling is sunsetted, then there is no obligation to follow that ruling. General Wiki rules and policies apply but you can't say that once there is a temporary RFC, or injunction, then any change requires a consensus or new RFC. Sir Joseph (talk) 15:46, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    SD

    I think Debresser should be sanctioned based on this tit for tat edit:[8] --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 02:50, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by (username)

    Result concerning Debresser

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    • The original Arbcom motion was passed on December 27, 2012. It provided that the ban on changing the lead of Jerusalem 'will be binding for three years from the adoption of this motion'. To me, that implies December 27, 2015, so the freeze on changing the lead has already expired. The RfC closers stated that 'this decision is binding for three years' on 9 July, 2013 but I don't see that the closers were given authority to change the date specified in Arbcom's own motion. EdJohnston (talk) 05:05, 8 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • Ed makes an interesting point. I do not recall any discussion about it, but then when we passed the appointments motion I don't think any of us expected the process to take half a year to conclude.

      That said, in my view, even after the three-year period ends, the conclusions reached in the RFC remain consensus until and unless the existence of a different consensus is demonstrated, and until then edits that are substantially contrary to those conclusions remain sanctionable under DS for failure to "comply with all applicable policies and guidelines" and "follow editorial and behavioural best practice" (see WP:AC/DS#guide.expect). T. Canens (talk) 05:22, 8 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    • If we accept T. Canens' view, we should place a new banner on the talk page of Jerusalem. We should tell editors they are risking a block if they change the lead away from the 2013 RfC version before such time as a different consensus is demonstrated. EdJohnston (talk) 03:15, 12 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • It appears that extending the freeze at Jerusalem is an option that is within our power, under discretionary sanctions. See WP:Arbitration/Requests/Clarification and Amendment#Clarification request: Genetically modified organisms where the committee is still considering a parallel issue regarding GMO. See the comments by User:Salvio giuliano and User:Drmies in that ARCA, though not everyone agrees with them. Why not keep this Jerusalem-related AE open until the ARCA finishes, and see if we want to propose something for Jerusalem. We could make a DS stating that the wording of the Jerusalem lead is still frozen until a new RfC is held. EdJohnston (talk) 14:33, 15 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
      • I have reopened the thread, because that request for clarification has been dealt with. As I said there, as far as I'm concerned, a restriction along the lines of that one would be a cromulent use of DS. Tarapia tapioco (aka Salvio) (talk) 08:24, 21 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • Unless there is an admin who wants to give us wording for a new discretionary sanction reinstating the freeze, I suggest this be closed with warnings to User:Debresser and User:Plot Spoiler. They changed wording that was agreed upon in a large RfC in 2013 without providing evidence of a new general consensus in favor of their version. I doubt that anyone is looking forward to a new edit war on the lead of Jerusalem. Given data we currently have, it appears that Debresser and Plot Spoiler are risking admin action if they continue, which might consist of blocks or a page ban. EdJohnston (talk) 15:26, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • I don't think we need to reinstate or extend the freeze, which is best read as a moratorium on new discussions; I do not currently see a need to prevent new RFCs on this topic. However, it is elementary that a consensus reached after an extensive and well-attended discussion requires a discussion of similar caliber to undo. Editors who ignore the existing consensus do so at their own peril. T. Canens (talk) 20:26, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • I perceive nothing sanctionable here, but I also would remind editors that "next year in Jerusalem" does not mean "next year more arguing about Jerusalem". Newyorkbrad (talk) 00:20, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • I agree broadly with T. Canens. If the wording was agreed upon after a broad and well-attended RfC, a new RfC of similar scope would be needed to propose changes to it, other than minor edits that do not substantially change its meaning or content. I'd suggest closing with a warning that seeking new consensus would be required prior to any such change. I don't, however, want to see an extension of any moratorium on such discussions, as it is an evolving situation, and it's entirely possible that events have necessitated changes or additions, or rendered some of the current information obsolete or inaccurate. Seraphimblade Talk to me 16:21, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
      • Since some editors seem to indicate that they do not intend to follow the RfC results or do not believe a new RfC is required for changes now, absent any significant objections, I'll be closing this with a page-level restriction that any significant changes to the lead would require a new RfC. For these purposes, "significant" would mean any change that adds or removes information from the lead or substantially changes the meaning of any part of it, but would exclude minor copyedits that do not substantially change the meaning of it. Seraphimblade Talk to me 23:40, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
        • @EdJohnston: Yeah, you've got a point, especially with as potentially as explosive as this area is, you could get arguments over even a seemingly innocuous change. If someone just fixes a typo or something, and someone actually brought that here as a complaint, I think they'd get told pretty sternly to quit wasting our time. Seraphimblade Talk to me 13:14, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • If it interests anyone, we're currently holding an RFC on GMOs based on the Jerusalem model, and the DS I logged to enforce it is as follows: "A moderated RfC is being held at Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Genetically modified organisms to determine how to phrase the safety of GM foods across all relevant articles. Whatever consensus is decided shall not be modified or overturned without an equivalent RfC. Additionally, the RFC is under further restrictions listed on that page and in the editnotice, including WP:0RR." The WordsmithTalk to me 14:34, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
      • I support User:Seraphimblade's idea of a page-level restriction at Jerusalem ruling out changes to the lead without a new RfC. I am unsure whether it will be easy to distinguish major from minor changes, so my preference would be to ban all changes, not just changes deemed to be significant. EdJohnston (talk) 02:05, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Wuerzele

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning Wuerzele

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    Kingofaces43 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 12:23, 22 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    Wuerzele (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Sanction or remedy to be enforced

    Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically_modified_organisms#Wuerzele_topic_banned

    Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically_modified_organisms#Casting_aspersions

    Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically_modified_organisms#Discretionary_Sanctions


    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. [9] Violates topic ban editing at Monsanto legal cases and returning to battleground behavior.
    2. [10] Casting asperisions
    Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
    1. Topic banned by ArbCom: "Wuerzele is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to genetically modified organisms and agricultural chemicals, broadly construed; appeals of this ban may be requested no earlier than twelve months since the date the case closed."[11]
    2. [12] Previously blocked for edit warring and general combativeness towards editors.
    If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
    • Mentioned by name in the Arbitration Committee's Final Decision linked to above.
    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    Wuerzele was previously topic banned for extremely combative behavior, constantly sniping at editors, etc. while edit warring[13] The discretionary sanctions and the topic bans handed out by ArbCom specifically say all pages relating to genetically modified organisms, agricultural chemicals, etc. broadly construed including the companies that produce them. The discretionary sanctions were specifically reworded by ArbCom[14] to include the companies themselves to prevent prevent a case like this where topic banned editors still try to hang around related pages and continue additional behavior problems.

    In addition to the diff itself being in the topic ban page, the edit summary shows a return to the very sniping behavior that resulted in their ArbCom topic ban, "Undid revision 726362373 by Kingofaces43 (talk) who appears not to read the newspaper? common knowledge, decent coverage". It's that kind of sniping directly at editors that Wuerzele has shown they are incapable of stopping that resulted in their ban, so I would like an admin to weigh in on how to further deal with their behavior. This response was to me removing the content from a previous editor for poor sourcing.[15] The lawsuit in particular involved a branch of Monsanto that's using climate modeling, etc. to recommend pesticide, fertilizer, etc. applications for farmers, which puts this content squarely in the realm of the topic ban without even needing to consider broadly construed.

    Wuerzele has also now engaged in apsersions: "No, I consider this retaliatory, because I exposed your relentlessly controlling, always pro-industry and negative editing behavior."[16] This was the exact attitude this ArbCom principle was meant to put a stop to and why Wuerzele was topic banned. That this is still continuing after their sanctions is a problem, especially since my edit removed content that actually favored the company (they were the one filing the complaint this time), which runs completely contrary to the hounding narrative Wuerzele is still trying to pursue against me.
    At this point, a one-way interaction ban from me seems logical to diffuse this continued behavior. The only times I ever interact with Wuerzele now is responding to when they engage in this behavior when they still pursue my edits. There shouldn't be a need for a two-way interaction ban since I generally try to avoid Wuerzele and haven't had anything with respect to Wuerzele that would warrant the two-way ban since the ArbCom case. Kingofaces43 (talk) 15:27, 22 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    EdJohnston, the WSJ source doesn't cover much detail, but other sources[17][18] regularly discuss things like seed choice, pesticide application, etc. as the core products of the decision making platform this company markets. There's really no way to say this doesn't relate to the topic ban in a broadly construed manner.

    The larger problem though is the continuation of sniping on multiple counts I mentioned above. Arbs specifically expanded the DS to company pages saying that they didn't need to expand the topic bans as DS would take care of editors that immediately jump into behavior that resulted in their bans again while testing the edge of their ban.[19] (read the arb opinions on topic bans) That's exactly what's happening here. Kingofaces43 (talk) 15:48, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

    [20]


    Discussion concerning Wuerzele

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by Wuerzele

    Statement by Tryptofish

    Just before I found this AE, I had seen the edit in question and reverted it. This is really a no-brainer: the page is about Monsanto, and it absolutely is within the scope of the topic ban. It's a pity, because Wuerzele has been doing a good job of obeying the sanctions until now. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:39, 22 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    About being within scope, Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically_modified_organisms#Discretionary_Sanctions specifically includes "the companies that produce them". --Tryptofish (talk) 22:43, 22 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    @EdJohnston: Yeah, I see what you mean and you are technically correct. (At this point, Tryptofish mumbles under breath about ArbCom dropping the ball about GMOs yet again.) The way I see it, I really do not care whether there is a block or a warning. As I said above, until this flare-up, I've been impressed with Wuerzele's adherence to the rules while remaining otherwise a good contributor. Looking back at the Arbs' statements in their vote not to expand the topic bans even while they were expanding the DS, I note that a couple of them said explicitly that it would be reasonable to apply DS to companies if the need arises for topic-banned editors, so that would justify a firm and final warning here, instead of a block. I also note with a bit of irony that the justification they gave was that the topic-banned editors hadn't tested this boundary yet. And, as someone who watched the whole case very closely, I feel that I am correct in saying that the change in the DS language was never meant as an expansion of the scope, but rather, as a clarification. Thus, companies really were included all along in the "broadly construed" part of the topic ban language, and maybe that should not allow for a get-out-of-jail free card. So that is an argument for an AE block. I guess it comes down to what Wuerzele could reasonably be expected to have understood from what the Committee articulated. --Tryptofish (talk) 19:11, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    Newyorkbrad, you make some very good points about civility and decorum. But I hope that the result of this AE will not take the form of saying "go ahead and edit through the loophole, but you are warned to be civil when you do so". If there is a warning, as opposed to a block based on "broadly construed" (and "broadly construed" really does need to mean something), I hope that it will be a warning that, in addition to civility, there should be no "company" edits going forward. Going forward, the inclusion of companies in the scope is clearly the Committee's intent. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:00, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by (username)

    Result concerning Wuerzele

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    @Tryptofish: Please see the linked page. In January 2016 the committee broadened the DS to include the companies but decided not to change the topic bans of those already sanctioned in the decision, including Wuerzele. They are still allowed to edit about the companies. EdJohnston (talk) 15:56, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • Even assuming there was no violation of the topic-ban, an edit summary like this one is uncivil and inappropriate. (The edit summary also reflects a misunderstanding of the edit Wuerzele was reverting; Kingofaces43 had questioned the notability or importance of Monsanto v. Chen, not whether the case exists or has been reported anywhere.) If Wuerzele plans to continue editing these articles to the extent permitted by (depending on one's viewpoint) either a limitation of or a loophole in the remedies, he should do so with civility and decorum. Subject to any explanation Wuerzele may provide, I would support a warning on this basis. Newyorkbrad (talk) 00:16, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
      • @Wuerzele: Please post a response to this request, addressing both the scope and civility issues, the next time you edit. Thank you. Newyorkbrad (talk) 14:57, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • If there's problematic editing here, it seems to me that the simplest solution would just be to extend the ban to the full covered area, including companies. Even if the Committee didn't do that at the time, the extension could be made as a discretionary sanction. Seraphimblade Talk to me 17:50, 2 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • Since 22 June, Wuerzele has made no further edits that raise concerns. I would close this with no action, but don't object if any admin wants to log their own warning to Wuerzele. The other two editors that were sanctioned by the committee in WP:ARBGMO, but not banned from editing about GMO companies, were User:SageRad and User:Jytdog. SageRad has made no edits since May, and Jytdog is indisposed due to another problem. So if there is indeed a multi-editor loophole about GMO companies that wants closing, it isn't causing much trouble at the moment. EdJohnston (talk) 02:01, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    HughD

    User blocked 6 months to enforce ban. User committed 5 new violations while the previous violations were actively being discussed here, showing no intent to comply with the existing restriction. The WordsmithTalk to me 04:45, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning HughD

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    Safehaven86 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 16:23, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    HughD (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Climate change.
    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. June 22 editing at Global Climate Coalition, clearly in scope of climate change topic ban
    2. June 27 continued editing at Global Climate Coalition, clearly in scope of climate change topic ban
    3. June 27 ditto
    Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
    1. May 8 HughD topic banned from climate change-related articles
    2. May 8 HughD blocked for one month for violating topic ban on American conservative politics
    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

    diff.

    Additional comments by editor filing complaint
    Whether or not your edits are good or bad faith, improvements or not improvements, is entirely irrelevant. You're simply not allowed to edit pages that you're topic banned from, regardless of the perceived quality or intention behind such edits. Safehaven86 (talk) 17:17, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    Requesting speedy action here as the user in question is not slowing down. See further obvious topic ban violation here Template:Did you know nominations/Global Climate Coalition and disruptive editing here. Safehaven86 (talk) 22:15, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Discussion concerning HughD

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by HughD

    All edits obvious good faith improvements. No disruption. Vexatious filing. Thank you. Hugh (talk) 16:47, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by (username)

    Result concerning HughD

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    • This activity (especially the agenda on display in the latter two edits linked above) is an obvious and flagrant topic ban violation. Recommend a three-month block, and will be enacting such unless there is substantive disagreement from other commenting administrators. --Laser brain (talk) 16:35, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • I agree. The violation is clear-cut and I don't see anything indicating that HughD is going to abide by the terms of his ban. Three months is fair. The WordsmithTalk to me 17:19, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    • Given how blatant this violation is, I'm almost inclined to indef, with the first year under AE. But if the consensus is for three months, I'll go with that. Seraphimblade Talk to me 17:50, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Aaabbb11

    Aaabbb11 is hereby indefinitely banned from editing and/or discussing topics related to the Falun Gong movement and/or the persecution thereof, broadly construed, across all namespaces. Coffee // have a cup // beans // 12:03, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning Aaabbb11

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    PCPP (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 17:22, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    Aaabbb11 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Falun_Gong_2 :

    (Disclaimer: I am current under a topic ban from 2011 over the FLG articles as documented here [21]. I have not edited WP in the years since, and currently I have no intention to edit the FLG articles or appeal the ban. I am writing this per WP:BANEX, where it refers to another user's conduct. I would be happy if an admin can clarify or notify me otherwise.)

    Aaabb11 is a single purpose account, whose sole major edits relates to editing the Falun Gong series of articles, often pushing a pro-FLG POV. As indicated by his edit counter, his most edited articles include Persecution of Falun Gong, Epoch Times, Kilgour-Matas report etc. [22].

    Aaabbb11's edit patterns are counterproductive, disruptive, and indicated has a serious problem with WP:COMPETENCE and WP:NPOV, often pushing blatant POVs which even other non-involved editors question. His basic habits is to push the views of Gutmann, Kilgour/Matas et al on organ harvesting into basic China or communism related articles.

    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

    1) POV pushing on the China page: [23]. In spite of others questioning the amount of undue weight, Aaabbb11 has continued to edit war on the page, pushing Kilgour-Matas, and "genocide" allegations, and push personal attacks against users who reverted him.

    • Personal attacks, called two editors, including one long term editor on the China articles, as Chinese trolls, and called for them to investigated [28][29]

    2) Soapboxing with the Gao Rongrong page [30]. The page, as noted by three different editors at AFC, has questionable notability [31][32][33]. Nevertheless, the article was created by Aaabbb11 on June 16, yet even per the article itself, the sources mostly date from 2005, and even the Daily Mail article from 2012 only gave a two pictures and sentences. Note his rationale for creation of the article, which has little to do with WP policies and guidelines, but to "embarrass the PRC government", "highlight the stupidity of the torturers", promote the FLG mouthpiece Epoch Times as "having strong focus on human rights", and interestingly, directly admitting that there is a lack of coverage of of Gao Rongrong's case, all highlighting an issue of competence.

    Aaabbb11 also previously inserted the the disputed image of the deceased woman, plus FLG soapboxing, onto the page about the electroshock weapon and cattle prod, [34][35] and not to mention scrolling down his own talk page.

    3) POV pushing on the Anti-communism page: [36].

    • Problematic article edits - continued attempts to push WP:UNDUE, plus misusing an image of a deceased FLG practitioner [37][38][39][40]
    • Note that his last edit on the article against is littered with WP:UNDUE, adding images that has little to do with anti-communism, more with FLG itself.[41]

    4) Deletion of sourced material on the Epoch Times page: [42]

    • Problematic article edits - deletion of sourced material referring to the paper as anti-CCP, pro-FLG [43][44][45][46]

    5) Attempts to change the article Persecution of Falun Gong to genocide, a position which is not supported by reliable sources. [47]. He also resorts to further soapboxing [48].

    6) Personal attacks, soapboxing etc.

    • [49] Referred to STSC as "denying the Chinese people from accessing true information"
    • [50] Later he called STSC a "propaganda victim" and WP would be better off without him.
    • [51][52] Referred to Zanhe and 小梨花 as single purpose accounts who should be investigated


    7) Notifications from other editors over behavior:

    • [53] Notified by Benlisquare over disrputive editing
    • [54][55] Notified by Benlisquare and Simonm223 over disruptive behavior at the China article
    • [56][57][58] Notified by STSC over disruptive editing and the improper use of dead woman's image


    Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
    1. [59] Previous block for edit-warring at the FLG main article space, over a wililink to the term "cult".


    If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
    • [60] Notified by JimRenge over discretionary sanctions on FLG.


    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    Overall, Aaabbb11's edits are are littered with promotion and POV pushing for FLG, and his edits on the FLG related articles and Gutmann, Kilgour, Matas, et al. are filled with clear advocacy. Content disputes aside, Aaabbb11's editing patterns and behavior indicates that he's a clear single purpose account who is here to push views not consistent with scholarly studies on the subject. I request

    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

    [61]

    Discussion concerning Aaabbb11

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by Aaabbb11

    Current editors such as Zujine and TheBlueCanoe should be asked for their opinion. None of the 3 people making statements against me is a current editor of Falun Gong pages, so I don't think their opinion counts as much as current editors such as Zujine and TheBlueCanoe who are extremely knowledgeable, experienced and respected in my opinion.

    I'd also like to point out that I gave up editing the China page some time ago. I change what I'm doing as I learn more and get bored with what I'm doing. I made mistakes in the past but I learn from them. I don't enjoy the conflict that happens on some wikipedia articles. Some people find the truth very hard to accept but it should be on wikipedia as much as possible. The truth is shocking sometimes. I'd like to forget about some of the things I know. 00:41, 29 June 2016‎

    The statements against me on 28 June by PPCP, Simon233 and STSC were made in less than 2 hours. It looks like collusion happening to me. Its probably time Happymonsoonday1 and Marvin 2009 were canvased for their opinions. They are current editors and have been editing longer than me. Aaabbb11 (talk) 05:34, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by simonm223

    For what it's worth, tendentious and probably paid full-time editors with substantial and persistent biases, like Aaabbb11 are the reason I don't edit wikipedia anymore. And frankly, I'm not likely to come back to Wikipedia if Aaabbb11 is gone, because the problem is systemic and persistent. But if any of you care about Wikipedia being anything other than a propaganda vehicle for whichever person has the most time and energy to burn fighting pointless battles you'll ban this user from ever editing anything even peripherally related to the Falun Gong or China. Simonm223 (talk) 17:42, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by STSC

    Aaabbb11's had indiscriminately inserted the image of Gao Rongrong in many articles (610 Office, Cattle prod, Electroshock weapon, Freedom of religion in China, Human rights in China, Anti-communism). When I complained about the inappropriate image inclusion [62], Aaabbb11 then deliberately posted 19 pieces of that image all over his/her talk page[63]. Just this disgraceful and disrespectful behaviour alone deserves a complete site ban. STSC (talk) 18:50, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by Rhoark

    I've looked at the diffs and see no basis for complaint. The filer is topic banned from this area and has no connection to the issue at hand that would activate BANEX. STSC needs to stop dropping people hostile templates like he owns the place. Simonm223 should tell us more about how he was canvassed, since he doesn't edit anymore. Close this with no action. Rhoark (talk) 22:05, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by TheBlueCanoe

    User:Rhoark is correct. Both PCPP and STSC have been indefinitely banned from the Falun Gong topic area, and nothing in WP:BANEX justifies their filing or commenting on this complaint.

    Unless we want to set a precedent that would allow banned users to clog up the arbitration process to pursue ideological vendettas, it seems that this complaint needs to be thrown out. If any active users want to file a complaint against Aaabbb11, then they're welcome to do that—I won't protest.TheBlueCanoe 21:30, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Result concerning Aaabbb11

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    • I'm certainly seeing an aggressive pattern in the edits and actions undertaken by Aaabbb11, which is cause for concern. I think a topic ban from Falun Gong might be in order, but will hear what Aaabbb11 has to say if they'd like to explain what's going on here. Seraphimblade Talk to me 20:31, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Monochrome Monitor

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning Monochrome Monitor

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    Nableezy (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 22:49, 2 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    Monochrome Monitor (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Palestine-Israel articles#General 1RR restriction
    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

    Zionism:

    1. 20:54, 2 July 2016 Revert of [64]
    2. 21:30, 2 July 2016 revert of [65]

    Baruch Goldstein:

    1. 15:55, 30 June 2016‎ Straight-forward removal of material, definitionally a revert
    2. 02:04, 1 July 2016‎ revert of [66]


    If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    Following a topic ban on Khazars Monochrome Monitor seemingly immediately continued with the same behavior that caused that ban, namely edit-warring and imposing his or her will through reverts. Additionally, the user has violated WP:BLP here (calling a living person a real-life loon[y]). Asked to remove that, the user declined.

    Im not planning on spending a whole lot of time on this request, however I feel compelled to note one thing. MM's response below shows what I think to be the main problem with this user editing in contentious topic areas. The need to personalize every single dispute. On his or her talk page I asked the user to self-revert on another article. His or her response there was that reverts should not be used wantonly, as mine had been. It was as if whoever has an editing conflict with the user must have some sort of personal grudge in which MM must win. I dont think Ive ever said two words about the president of Turkey, but my request that the user abide by a core Wikipedia policy turns into how low [I] descend just to f*ck [MM] over, suddenly caring about not offending a man who says turkey doesn't need to apologize for the armenian genocide. Its this repeated seeking out an escalation of conflict thats the core problem. One revert on one article begets a 20 article editing binge of removing categories. I dont know how to solve that problem, but time editing in less contentious topics where he or she can get a better handle on the consensual editing model of this place I think would be to his or her benefit. nableezy - 03:23, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    Hopefully the last note; the disingenuous I didnt know about the edit 3 weeks ago is just that, disingeneous. MM has been involved with talk page discussion that has been centered precisely around whether or not to use establish or re-restablish (here). How exactly can he or she feign ignorance of the dispute? The user repeatedly uses reverts to impose his or her favored version on an article, and this is just the latest example of that. Other recent examples include Dahiya doctrine. Really any article where MM is found contains the same pattern. The user decides whats best, makes that edit, and reverts anybody who disagrees. And then says those reverting him or her are doing so "wantonly" and can be ignored. nableezy - 18:08, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

    Notified

    Discussion concerning Monochrome Monitor

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by Monochrome Monitor

    Already covered on my talk page, thanks.

    This article is under WP:1RR due to ARBPIA. It my be in your interest to undo your last edit. Thank you, EdJohnston (talk) 02:17, 1 July 2016 (UTC) Thank you for telling me but the date says it's a new day. :) --Monochrome_Monitor 02:54, 1 July 2016 (UTC)

    The definition of a WP:1RR violation is two reverts within a 24-hour period. It doesn't matter whether the reverts are on the same day. EdJohnston (talk) 03:05, 1 July 2016 (UTC)
    Thanks then!--Monochrome_Monitor 03:15, 1 July 2016 (UTC)
    Looks like I already undid it ooops.Jonney2000 (talk) 03:17, 1 July 2016 (UTC)

    That ^^^ I did not realize that I violated 1RR, edjohnston was very nice and warned me, so I said I would self-revert. But Jonney already did. You're saying because someone reverted it before I could revert myself, it's a 1RR violation?

    [67] That is called a revert. I used my 1 revert for the day on it. I reverted nish's edit which I thought made unfair changes not mentioned on the talk page and misinterpreted a source. But that doesn't matter. This [68] is not a revert. You are telling me that because someone typed three characters weeks ago, and I deleted those three characters by writing what I had already proposed on the talk page, that's a revert, despite all the edits in between. That is completely insane. You're being vindictive and mean.--Monochrome_Monitor 00:07, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    I did not say he was a "loony". I mentioned loonies with a hyperlink about him next to it. I'm really amazed how low you descend just to f*ck me over, suddenly caring about not offending a man who says turkey doesn't need to apologize for the armenian genocide, because they "committed no crime".[1]--Monochrome_Monitor 00:17, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    More crap

    [Reply to Malik Shabazz] I discussed it with you, and you didn't make a compelling case at all. You did what you are doing now. Complaining about something you don't understand, pretending I removed categories that I actually added. I don't understand what is ideologically driven about changing "terrorism" to "war crimes" based on the date Israel was established and the jewish paramilitaries came together to become the IDF. State = war crimes. Non-state = terrorism. This is the definition wikipedia itself uses! It's not arbitrary at all,. Thus massacres committed by israel as a state I added "war crime", and massacres of the PLO during the lebanese civil war I added "terrorism". I have been ENTIRELY consistent except in one case- suicide bombings being labeled a war crime, they were in that category and I wasn't sure what to call it considering it has been called both, and its possible to have it be both in the case of state-sponsored terrorism. I'm trying to have a debate- you didn't debate me. You are being reactionary. You don't understand my edits. So, ask me about them. --Monochrome_Monitor 02:41, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    "The entire spectrum of Zionist opinion believed, and still believes, that Eretz Yisrael extends to the east of the river jordan..." That's a gross generalization. The bible can say whatever it likes, it can say that the land of israel is from the nile to the euphrates- but that doesn't mean Jews believe it. Jordan has banned observant Jews from entering the country because they are afraid Jews will plant artifacts into the ground and claim the land as israeli.[2] That's how quickly this enters conspiracy theory territory.--Monochrome_Monitor 03:17, 3 July 2016 (UTC) You think that edit is inspired by "extreme ideology"? It is anti-extreme ideology.Only extreme religious zionists include parts of jordan into israel. Not "the entire spectrum". Hell, on one side of the spectrum of "zionists" they don't even think jerusalem is part of Israel.--Monochrome_Monitor 03:17, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    The section you linked to- "please tell me...." I was asking you to tell me how the palestinian exodus is a war crime under the rome statue or terrorism. You never explained. But when I make the edits, I'm being an extremist, even if you never tell me what's wrong with them. You have to give me a bit more to work with. I've been TRYING to branch out, that's why I made the lede in zionism more nuetral today (for which I was reported) and that's why I started to populated the category "Israeli war crimes". --Monochrome_Monitor 03:25, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    On "eretz israel" and how zionists interpret it. We are led to believe from our source that all zionists consider eretz israel to include parts of jordan. Here's a dictionary definition: [69]

    1. the Holy Land; Israel
    2. the concept, favoured by some extreme Zionists, of a Jewish state the territory of which matched the largest expanse of biblical Israel

    Those are two different definitions....she's distorting the phrase. And, I think that's not just a regular untruth, but a dangerous one that leads to prejudice. --Monochrome_Monitor 03:34, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    And another thing...

    [Reply to Nish] I did not call falk an antisemite. I said "he has antisemitic views". He thinks Israel was involved in 9/11. I believe that's an antisemitic view, don't you? They are not the same thing. An antisemite is one who hates Jews. An antisemitic view is a view characterized by antisemitism. Falk does not hate Jews. However he has some antisemitic views- saying "he's a respected scholar and here are his medals" is silly. The controversy is described in detail on his wikipedia page. And I stand by my statement about Atzmon. Regardless of your qualms about my editing practices, I DID NOT BREAK 1RR THIS TIME. Making an edit that "un-did" a three week old edit I didn't know existed is not a revert. And I know about state-sponsored terrorism. Israel has sponsored "terrorists". But that's difference from state terrorism, which is a more dubious concept. The IDF is not "sponsored" by Israel. It is Israel. Hence, saying a massacre by the IDF is terrorism is accusing Israel of state terrorism. It's a lot more reasonable to just call it a "war crime".--Monochrome_Monitor 17:46, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    On the Armenian genocide, what I consider crazy about his views is his belief that no crime was committed. In contrast Israelis (except one azerbajani jerk) know that a crime was committed, a genocide was committed, but they don't call it that because they don't want to upset Turkey. What do I call them? Hypocritical moral cowards.--Monochrome_Monitor 18:06, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    As for the reliable sources I removed, one I removed by accident which was a reliable source, for that I bear responsibility. The one I meant to remove (and did remove) was 972, which I don't consider a reliable source.--Monochrome_Monitor 18:01, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    I'm sick of being dragged to AAE for diplomatic disputes... but I guess I have made people afraid to talk to me. Have I broken any rules? No. That being said, I have let my own emotions spiral out of control on some talk pages. I have gotten into conflicts with editors that could have been avoided if I discussed my thoughts first and not after the fact, when they had already formed their own conceptions about my intentions. But I stated my intentions clearly up above, and I'd like to be judged on that, rather than how other people feel about me.--Monochrome_Monitor 17:55, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Hopefully the last section [reply to nableezy]

    Of course I know about the dispute, the dispute is why I made it, as a compromise. I changed the wording of the first sentence to my proposal on the talk page. But every change of wording that has some overlap with a change undone in the past cannot be considered a "revert" of someone else's edits made some time in the past. My first edit was an edit, my second was a revert. By your logic YOU violated 1RR by restoring content removed two years ago. This is a revert of this. This is a revert of this--Monochrome_Monitor 18:58, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    I guess not

    Simon, you gave up on me a long time ago. You didn't respond to any of my comments on your talk page. Your emails have grown colder and eventually you ceased to respond to those too. Mere months ago you made glowing comments about my work on wikipedia. Most of my bans and offenses were before then. My edits have not changed- I've always made bold edits first and substantiated them later. The only difference is that when my bold edits are reverted, I expect the reverter to at least make the effort to address my concerns, and if they don't I continue to press for them. That's it. As for the Khazars, there was no "fiasco". I violated 3RR, that's it. If you want to make that into a cause for never speaking to me again, be my guest. At least have the decency to follow through with it and don't pitch in to my public humiliation after weeks of shunning me. As for Bolter, bless him, but the comparisons are ridiculous. When you took him under your wing you asked me to talk to him and give him advice, because I was your success story. I made the edit to Zionism against my usual POV as a compromise, this compromise was seen as an opportunity to make a radical change to the wording, which I reverted. And I get f*cked over it. I have been extremely careful in adhering to 1RR, and I did adhere to it. That's all I have to say.--Monochrome_Monitor 06:54, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by Malik Shabazz

    Please sanction Monochrome Monitor, who has repeatedly proven that she cannot edit with an NPOV. She is one of the most transparently ideologically driven editors I can recall from nearly ten years of editing, and she gets worse, instead of better, the longer she is here.

    Today, for example, she removed a sentence from Land of Israel because she didn't like it, writing "now that's just wrong". It didn't matter that the sentence is supported by a reliable source written by a reputable historian, given in-text attribution, and easily verifiable.

    Yesterday, she removed the categories related to war crimes and terrorism from Israeli articles and categories and added them to Palestinian articles and categories. When I called her on it, she initially made some noise about state actors and non-state actors. But she can't have it both ways—exempt Israel because it is a state, treat Palestine as a state when it suits her ideological drive, and deny it is a state when that suits her. (Here are a few diffs: [70][71][72][73]. See Monochrome Monitor's contribution history for dozens more. See User talk:Malik Shabazz#Please tell me... for the discussion.)

    Monochrome Monitor is also allergic to discussion. Despite the entreaties of her mentor, and others (including me), she refuses to start discussions about (for example) where categories about terrorism and war crimes are appropriate.

    Please. Enough is enough. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 01:58, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by Nishidani

    The evidence is a small sample of a persistent wrongheadedness over numerous pages. I have an informal undertaking with MM's mentor to be patient. I lost that patience on just one page, Khazars, and requested she be suspended for a month from just that page. She was suspended for six, which I though somewhat excessive, and told her so. She was upset, but we smoothed things over.

    • Her reply to Malik is that he is ‘Complaining about something you don't understand’ because ‘State = war crimes. Non-state = terrorism. This is the definition wikipedia itself uses! It's not arbitrary at all.’

    She got this from? Well, a wikipedia article, i.e. Definitions of terrorism.

    Wikipedia articles aren’t authoritative. We have, in contradiction to that article Iran and state-sponsored terrorism, for example. Malik was quite correct to complain of a rampage over cats. A moment’s notice, rather that causing just one more lengthy thread to debate MM’s subjective judgements, would have sufficed to show that the concept of state terrorism is widely debated and accepted in the relevant scholarship. I.e. here, here, ‘This foremost distinction between State and sub-State (or individual) terrorism is now a generally acceptable component of the debate on terrorism.' or here. She read a conclusion on a wiki article, drew an opinion from it, ignored any quality check in readily available reliable academic sources, and barged over several articles to alter them.

    The BLP violation may be piddling, but her mentors, people of loyalty, integrity and high intelligence, unlike myself, gave her the same advice as Nableezy and I did, and she refused to budge. The result, endless negotiationsa and hours wasted on researching the trivia that inform her judgements to show her how superficially sourced her information was for rushing to brand people antisemites. Despite those gentle remonstrations, she still has left unstruck those accusations against living public figures,Richard Falk and Gilad Atzmon, two Jews, are antisemites, and Erdogan is a loonie.

    (ps.) Erdogan doesn’t recognize the obvious, i.e. the Armenian genocide. True. But if he is a loonie for that, then what do we make of authoritative Israeli figures who repeat that israel has no intention of recognizing the Armenian genocide.

    I am strongly opposed to harsh measures generally, and if she merits a sanction it should be broadly on this topic area, but for no more than a month. She just has to get it into her head that endless drama, repeating the same behavior, and attritional attitudes that exhaust everyone's time and patience, including that of her mentors, will, the next time round, lead to less lenience. A last warning (of several) in shortNishidani (talk) 13:07, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    I did not call falk an antisemite. I said "he has antisemitic views".
    Let me translate. I did not call X a racist. I said:"X has racist views".Nishidani (talk) 19:38, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

    Statement by Irondome

    This statement may exceed 500 words. I would ask the reviewing administrator to indulge me. I will keep it as short as possible.

    I am no longer MM's mentor. That arrangement ceased after the Khazar fiasco. I am no longer MM's mentor because one cannot mentor a fellow editor who refuses to be mentored. I am now merely an impotent observer, watching the gradual self-destruction of what I originally percieved to be a capable young female editor with potential. My final offer in terms of mentoring are documented in the Khazar AE. My perception was that they were accepted out of a desperate attempt to continue editing in that topic. Not once have you, MM, asked my advice on a planned edit, or even on what topics you are editing. This is in stark contrast to Bolter21, whom with I also have an arrangement, (although Bolter arguably no longer needs assistance, after a very brief initial issue when he first joined.) Yet he continues to ask for advice and is a credit to the new generation of young colleague who are capable, and are serious about the project. What pains me is MM's attitude to other, well respected editors. Colleagues like Nishidani, Malik, and Nableezy, who I hugely respect and who have forgotten more than I will ever know in these topic areas, MM treats with an unfortunate, often rude tone. Differing POVs are no barrier to mutual respect, affection and even friendship. MM at this point is combative to a disturbing extent. I have noted a deterioration in your behaviour MM, and that the intervals between board visits are becoming shorter. MM and Gilad Atzmon are two sides of the same coin. Both are struggling, through radically different pathways, to make sense of their Judiasm and the enormous impact that the Jewish experience can have on the individual. It can be hard work being a Jew, as I well know. But it does not excuse bad behaviour, whatever your place in the wildly diverse spectrum of the Jewish intellectual and ethical experience. I will make one last attempt to reach out to you MM, based on my previous offer. I would ask you to voluntarily take a two month break from all IP or Jewish related topics. When you return, maybe we can talk. This has not been a pleasant posting to make, trust me on that colleagues.

    Result concerning Monochrome Monitor

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